I believe that what the US is doing is going to make the Middle East better in the end.
The people are starting to question their oppressive governments. They see free people in other countries, they are angry that their government does nothing to make their lives better, and at some point they are not going to take it anymore.
There is much more democracy and hope in the Middle East due to what America has done in the Last 5 years than all the years of "talking" and "diplomacy" could do.
It seems that as long as radical Islam is apart of the Middle East, things will be bad. I don't think there is ANYTHING ANYONE can do to completely get rid of that...so things will NEVER be as good as we want them to be...but if we can get enough people to start believing it is possible to have a better life....maybe things can change a bit for the better...
Here are a few quotes I find interesting from the article:
There is a huge amount of anger here about what is happening in Lebanon, but it is not all the result of Israeli bombs, missiles and artillery.
“Of course I am angry,’’ said Hamid Akbari, 30, a deliveryman. “All our income is going to Palestine and Hezbollah.”
“We Iranians have a saying,” said Ali Reza Moradi, 35, a portrait artist who works in a small booth downtown. “We should save our own house first and then save the mosque. A lot of people think this way. The government should help its people first, and then help the people in Lebanon.”
“One percent of our budget has been approved by my Parliament to give to Palestine,” he said. “Why should I not get angry about this?”
Monday, July 24, 2006
In Iran’s Streets, Aid to Hezbollah Stirs Resentment
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Since when is dissention over rigthwing authoritarianism something new in Iran. Its been going on almost since the 50's when the US put a brutal thug in power. Iran has the most educated country in the world of Islam. The people have a bundle of social and civil rights, and use them to protest ALL THE TIME. This isnt anything new. GWB had absolutely nothing to do with this.
but he does have something to do with Israel and Hezbollah?
Rhyno--
Are you trying to say the Ayatollahs are better than the Shah? The Shah was corrupt, but at least wasn't a tool for the Soviets, like Mossadegh. The Shah also wasn't stoning women for homosexuality, nor was the Shah hanging individuals for the crime of sodomy.
Thank that rightwing Jimmy Carter guy for this collosal human rights disaster. The Shah was authoritarian and corrupt, but ideologically he was a progressive, and with respect to personality he wasn't an apocalyptic madman like Ahmadinejad.
Socialists and their libertarian friends have no clue how to conduct a solid foreign policy.
"There is much more democracy and hope in the Middle East due to what America has done in the Last 5 years than all the years of "talking" and "diplomacy" could do."
Really!!?? How?
Iraq...democracy
Afghanistan...democracy
Saudi Arabia...more rights for women
Talking and being nice to terrorist...nothing
Game, Afghanistan had more rights for men and women when they were a communist country in the 70's, then GWB could ever hope for. Still, it would be nice if he would finish one fight before using up resources on a lie to start his own private one someplace else.
That behind us, yes, jason. They are better off. The Shah was as progressive as Nixon, and nothing but a pillow biting, cowardly bitch boy for the US and Britain. Thanks for bringing up Mossadegh, too. He was a constitutionally legal, and democratically elected Prime Minister. Its always nice when cons show their true, unpatriotic...unconstitional, colors. You cant pick and choose where democracy and republicanism are going to be accepted. Doing so is called fascism.
There is more law there now than there ever was under the Shah cuz he felt he was above it. At least Iranians can now know exactly what will get themn in trouble. In the 60's and 70's, everything was legal, so they would spirit you away in the middle of the night, or other, when you did something they didnt want. They executed people capriciously and without the backing of law. After the revolution, the middle class widened, and people's purchasing power rose. To top it off, the Iranian science film industries are prolific and of quality. Its much better.
"You cant pick and choose where democracy and republicanism are going to be accepted."
Sure we can. Not all democracies are liberal democracies, and during the cold war, it was important to contain Communism.
What the hell is this, libertarians for communism and theocracy? Watch this video of someone getting stoned to death in Iran and then tell how things are "much better" under the Ayatollahs. They have Rule of Law now. Sharia law.
Don't watch it if you have a weak stomach.
rhyno has a lot of "special" comments the last few days...todays special comment is that the people of Iran are better off with the most fucked up, craziest leader of any country in quite awhile...maybe even worse that Hitler...that has yet to be seen...hope he isn't, or is killed before he can prove he is...
and don't bring up that video..it blows a hole in the liberal theory that we are the worst country in the world..
Iraq chose sharia law just like jason abhors. Iraq was the number one enemy of Iran and vis versa..guess who gets to fight now? Not you or jason we know that for sure.
Afganistan. no worse than it was but the Taliban which we in america helped to create is gaining a foothold once again..once again because of the dear leaders' lack of a policy or follow through.
Saudi Arabia..still the home of wahabbism. They just like us for all our oil money..which goes eventually many times to fund terrorism..another failed plan.
A couple of years ago Saddam was the most fucked up craziest leader in a long time..before that bin lauden.
"the liberal theory that we are the worst country in the world.. "
Not a liberal theory except in your own mind..because liberals care what is done in there name as Americans more than what others do and speak out about it doesn't mean they "hate America". That is just your warped world view.
Anti- american Zapatero(psoe) blames Israel. Zapatero hates Israel
No, game. No, jason. Your opinions are not backed up by any evidence, only your own subjective viewpoints. Cons are so full of hypocrisy and arrogance it blows my mind. There are so many instances of the US butting in where it wasnt wanted or needed, and fucking everything up that I could write a book here. Indeed, several books HAVE been written on the same subject. However, since we are speaking of Afghanistan and Iran here, I will limit it to them.
Afghanistan was a progressive and idealistic, but Communist country in the 70's. Mostly, this was because of its geography, between the USSR and China. It was so progressive, that it irritated some of the right-wing religious Cons, and they started trouble. Mostly, these groups were funded by the US and the West. Their most famous prodigy being Usama bin Laden. After the USSR invaded to help out its neighbor, the Reaganized West started pumping egregious amounts of money and weapons into Usama bin Ladens hands, under the pretext of fighting for 'democracy'(the spin that anything anti-Communist was somehow pro-democracy). After the USSR pulled out and fell apart, as we all know, Usama and the religious fanatics formed the Taliban and proceeded to control the whole country. They used this as a base to train other religious fanatics, leading ultimately to the attack on the WTC in 2001.
In Iran, the Brits overthrew a legit monarch, because he was independent and strong, and replaced him with a compliant ass-bitch. The US became involved in the 50's during the aforementioned coup against Mossadegh. They continued the sham for decades of increasingly brutal and un-democratic rule by the Shah. His thug rule led more and more citizens to look to a Moslem cleric named Khomeni to help them out of the crisis. After a revolution replaced the US's chosen non-democracy with an anti-US(wouldnt you be?) Islamic Republic, the US chose to back a new player in the region. The anti Iranian leader of Iraq, Saddam Hussein. We had a new bitch boy, or so we thought. So, the US pumped money and weapons and technology into Iraq, all to the benefit of Saddam. When he proved non-compliant, we turned on him, and he used all that money to buy weapons and technology from the Soviets. Iran, then, went on to hate the US even more for backing a Mid East pariah against them in a war that they lost almost a million men. Is there really wonder on why they choose to poke at our allies in the region? Note, everyone with a brain knows Saudi Arabia is not an ally.
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